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| | | Author: | BricksByTRiver  | | Posted: | Jan 16, 2024 00:39 | | Subject: | Fraudulent requests to not pay TAXES | | Viewed: | 229 times | | Topic: | Problem Order | |
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| Dear all,
In the last few months, we received 2 requests from buyers requesting us to fill
in the customs form with the total price much below the total cost to avoid paying
taxes in their countries (bigbao and lycaneart). Worst, they requested us to
commit fraud in our own country.
Those orders were canceled, so we lost 15 euros to PayPal fees.
If this happens again, we are thinking of not replying to the buyer about their
request and just sending the order with the customs form filled in correctly.
What do you think?
Don't you agree that the Bricklink Team could include a message in the newsletters
reinforcing the message that this kind of request is totally illegal everywhere
in the world, and it is not a special request from the stores (if they have that
information in terms of service)?
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| | | | | Author: | Nubs_Select | | Posted: | Jan 16, 2024 00:45 | | Subject: | Re: Fraudulent requests to not pay TAXES | | Viewed: | 64 times | | Topic: | Problem Order | |
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| Unless I’m missing something you don’t have to cancel the order. I’ve gotten
messages like that a few times and just tell them no and ship the order out with
the full amount on the forums and havnt had any issues. (It might be different
in Europe but can’t you adjust your terms to say if they do that that you just
won’t refund the PayPal fees or something?)
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| | | | | | | Author: | BricksByTRiver | | Posted: | Jan 16, 2024 09:27 | | Subject: | Re: Fraudulent requests to not pay TAXES | | Viewed: | 48 times | | Topic: | Problem Order | |
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| We cannot include such message in our terms in European Union.
In Problem Order, Nubs_Select writes:
| | Unless I’m missing something you don’t have to cancel the order. I’ve gotten
messages like that a few times and just tell them no and ship the order out with
the full amount on the forums and havnt had any issues. (It might be different
in Europe but can’t you adjust your terms to say if they do that that you just
won’t refund the PayPal fees or something?)
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| | | | | Author: | DanialR | | Posted: | Jan 16, 2024 00:50 | | Subject: | Re: Fraudulent requests to not pay TAXES | | Viewed: | 54 times | | Topic: | Problem Order | |
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| In Problem Order, BricksByTRiver writes:
| | Dear all,
In the last few months, we received 2 requests from buyers requesting us to fill
in the customs form with the total price much below the total cost to avoid paying
taxes in their countries (bigbao and lycaneart). Worst, they requested us to
commit fraud in our own country.
Those orders were canceled, so we lost 15 euros to PayPal fees.
If this happens again, we are thinking of not replying to the buyer about their
request and just sending the order with the customs form filled in correctly.
What do you think?
|
I wonder what would happen if a copy of their email requesting the lower cost
accidentally ended up with the customs forms? 
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| | | | | | | Author: | Nubs_Select | | Posted: | Jan 16, 2024 00:56 | | Subject: | Re: Fraudulent requests to not pay TAXES | | Viewed: | 64 times | | Topic: | Problem Order | |
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| In Problem Order, DanialR writes:
| | In Problem Order, BricksByTRiver writes:
| | Dear all,
In the last few months, we received 2 requests from buyers requesting us to fill
in the customs form with the total price much below the total cost to avoid paying
taxes in their countries (bigbao and lycaneart). Worst, they requested us to
commit fraud in our own country.
Those orders were canceled, so we lost 15 euros to PayPal fees.
If this happens again, we are thinking of not replying to the buyer about their
request and just sending the order with the customs form filled in correctly.
What do you think?
|
I wonder what would happen if a copy of their email requesting the lower cost
accidentally ended up with the customs forms?
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| | | | | | | Author: | zorbanj | | Posted: | Jan 16, 2024 09:20 | | Subject: | Re: Fraudulent requests to not pay TAXES | | Viewed: | 50 times | | Topic: | Problem Order | |
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| In Problem Order, DanialR writes:
| | In Problem Order, BricksByTRiver writes:
| | Dear all,
In the last few months, we received 2 requests from buyers requesting us to fill
in the customs form with the total price much below the total cost to avoid paying
taxes in their countries (bigbao and lycaneart). Worst, they requested us to
commit fraud in our own country.
Those orders were canceled, so we lost 15 euros to PayPal fees.
If this happens again, we are thinking of not replying to the buyer about their
request and just sending the order with the customs form filled in correctly.
What do you think?
|
I wonder what would happen if a copy of their email requesting the lower cost
accidentally ended up with the customs forms?
|
Nothing would happen. The buyer either pays the customs duties or refuses. Upon
refusal the package will be returned to the seller, and the seller will be out
the cost of shipping on top of the PayPal fees.
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | BricksByTRiver | | Posted: | Jan 16, 2024 09:30 | | Subject: | Re: Fraudulent requests to not pay TAXES | | Viewed: | 38 times | | Topic: | Problem Order | |
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| In Problem Order, zorbanj writes:
| | In Problem Order, DanialR writes:
| | In Problem Order, BricksByTRiver writes:
| | Dear all,
In the last few months, we received 2 requests from buyers requesting us to fill
in the customs form with the total price much below the total cost to avoid paying
taxes in their countries (bigbao and lycaneart). Worst, they requested us to
commit fraud in our own country.
Those orders were canceled, so we lost 15 euros to PayPal fees.
If this happens again, we are thinking of not replying to the buyer about their
request and just sending the order with the customs form filled in correctly.
What do you think?
|
I wonder what would happen if a copy of their email requesting the lower cost
accidentally ended up with the customs forms?
|
Nothing would happen. The buyer either pays the customs duties or refuses. Upon
refusal the package will be returned to the seller, and the seller will be out
the cost of shipping on top of the PayPal fees.
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That's exactly why we canceled the orders...
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | Brickhunter85 | | Posted: | Jan 16, 2024 09:53 | | Subject: | Re: Fraudulent requests to not pay TAXES | | Viewed: | 36 times | | Topic: | Problem Order | |
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| In Problem Order, zorbanj writes:
| | In Problem Order, DanialR writes:
| | In Problem Order, BricksByTRiver writes:
| | Dear all,
In the last few months, we received 2 requests from buyers requesting us to fill
in the customs form with the total price much below the total cost to avoid paying
taxes in their countries (bigbao and lycaneart). Worst, they requested us to
commit fraud in our own country.
Those orders were canceled, so we lost 15 euros to PayPal fees.
If this happens again, we are thinking of not replying to the buyer about their
request and just sending the order with the customs form filled in correctly.
What do you think?
|
I wonder what would happen if a copy of their email requesting the lower cost
accidentally ended up with the customs forms?
|
Nothing would happen. The buyer either pays the customs duties or refuses. Upon
refusal the package will be returned to the seller, and the seller will be out
the cost of shipping on top of the PayPal fees.
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Not here in Germany, when a buyer denies the package, we are allowed only to
refund the part value and keep the shipping, returning cost and any fees.
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | yorbrick | | Posted: | Jan 16, 2024 12:47 | | Subject: | Re: Fraudulent requests to not pay TAXES | | Viewed: | 42 times | | Topic: | Problem Order | |
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| I don't know if it still the case but in the past PayPal have blocked non-delivered
claims where a seller has proof the buyer refused to pay import duty. Credit
card complaints would probably still trump that though.
Better to refuse the order, and stoplist the buyer.
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| | | | | | | Author: | Poncke | | Posted: | Jan 16, 2024 09:27 | | Subject: | Re: Fraudulent requests to not pay TAXES | | Viewed: | 40 times | | Topic: | Problem Order | |
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| In Problem Order, DanialR writes:
| | In Problem Order, BricksByTRiver writes:
| | Dear all,
In the last few months, we received 2 requests from buyers requesting us to fill
in the customs form with the total price much below the total cost to avoid paying
taxes in their countries (bigbao and lycaneart). Worst, they requested us to
commit fraud in our own country.
Those orders were canceled, so we lost 15 euros to PayPal fees.
If this happens again, we are thinking of not replying to the buyer about their
request and just sending the order with the customs form filled in correctly.
What do you think?
|
I wonder what would happen if a copy of their email requesting the lower cost
accidentally ended up with the customs forms?
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What would that achieve?
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | DanialR | | Posted: | Jan 16, 2024 20:08 | | Subject: | Re: Fraudulent requests to not pay TAXES | | Viewed: | 61 times | | Topic: | Problem Order | |
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| In Problem Order, Poncke writes:
| | In Problem Order, DanialR writes:
| | In Problem Order, BricksByTRiver writes:
| | Dear all,
In the last few months, we received 2 requests from buyers requesting us to fill
in the customs form with the total price much below the total cost to avoid paying
taxes in their countries (bigbao and lycaneart). Worst, they requested us to
commit fraud in our own country.
Those orders were canceled, so we lost 15 euros to PayPal fees.
If this happens again, we are thinking of not replying to the buyer about their
request and just sending the order with the customs form filled in correctly.
What do you think?
|
I wonder what would happen if a copy of their email requesting the lower cost
accidentally ended up with the customs forms?
|
What would that achieve?
|
Would the buyer get flagged by Customs for possible tax evasion resulting in
more attention on future packages to them.
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| | | | | Author: | Brickwilbo | | Posted: | Jan 16, 2024 01:15 | | Subject: | Re: Fraudulent requests to not pay TAXES | | Viewed: | 67 times | | Topic: | Problem Order | |
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| In Problem Order, BricksByTRiver writes:
| | Dear all,
In the last few months, we received 2 requests from buyers requesting us to fill
in the customs form with the total price much below the total cost to avoid paying
taxes in their countries (bigbao and lycaneart). Worst, they requested us to
commit fraud in our own country.
Those orders were canceled, so we lost 15 euros to PayPal fees.
If this happens again, we are thinking of not replying to the buyer about their
request and just sending the order with the customs form filled in correctly.
What do you think?
Don't you agree that the Bricklink Team could include a message in the newsletters
reinforcing the message that this kind of request is totally illegal everywhere
in the world, and it is not a special request from the stores (if they have that
information in terms of service)?
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It's against the TOS, which we all agreed to.
You can report them to Bricklink: https://www.bricklink.com/problemMember.asp
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| | | | | Author: | zorbanj | | Posted: | Jan 16, 2024 09:18 | | Subject: | Re: Fraudulent requests to not pay TAXES | | Viewed: | 53 times | | Topic: | Problem Order | |
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| In Problem Order, BricksByTRiver writes:
| | Dear all,
In the last few months, we received 2 requests from buyers requesting us to fill
in the customs form with the total price much below the total cost to avoid paying
taxes in their countries (bigbao and lycaneart). Worst, they requested us to
commit fraud in our own country.
Those orders were canceled, so we lost 15 euros to PayPal fees.
If this happens again, we are thinking of not replying to the buyer about their
request and just sending the order with the customs form filled in correctly.
What do you think?
|
The buyer could refuse to pay the customs fees. The package will then be returned
to you, and you will lose the shipping costs paid on top of the PayPal fees.
You can language on your terms page stating that you will not undervalue orders
for customs forms - there are many examples from other stores that you can copy.
You can also hold back the PayPal fees when you refund a cancelled order, but
you may get negative feedback as a result. Or you can do what you are doind now
and eat the PayPal fees as a cost of doing business and report the buyers.
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| | | | | | | Author: | BricksByTRiver | | Posted: | Jan 16, 2024 09:39 | | Subject: | Re: Fraudulent requests to not pay TAXES | | Viewed: | 41 times | | Topic: | Problem Order | |
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| In Problem Order, zorbanj writes:
| | In Problem Order, BricksByTRiver writes:
| | Dear all,
In the last few months, we received 2 requests from buyers requesting us to fill
in the customs form with the total price much below the total cost to avoid paying
taxes in their countries (bigbao and lycaneart). Worst, they requested us to
commit fraud in our own country.
Those orders were canceled, so we lost 15 euros to PayPal fees.
If this happens again, we are thinking of not replying to the buyer about their
request and just sending the order with the customs form filled in correctly.
What do you think?
|
The buyer could refuse to pay the customs fees. The package will then be returned
to you, and you will lose the shipping costs paid on top of the PayPal fees.
You can language on your terms page stating that you will not undervalue orders
for customs forms - there are many examples from other stores that you can copy.
You can also hold back the PayPal fees when you refund a cancelled order, but
you may get negative feedback as a result. Or you can do what you are doind now
and eat the PayPal fees as a cost of doing business and report the buyers.
|
Or we can send the order, then it returns and then we paid the Paypal fees and
also the shipping...
We have information about the customs form in our terms.
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| | | | | Author: | 1001bricks | | Posted: | Jan 16, 2024 09:41 | | Subject: | Re: Fraudulent requests to not pay TAXES | | Viewed: | 46 times | | Topic: | Problem Order | |
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| | | In the last few months, we received 2 requests from buyers requesting us to fill
in the customs form with the total price much below the total cost to avoid paying
taxes in their countries
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It's not super cool to shame them in Forum, IMO.
It's your decision to either:
* ship as asked,
* ship full value,
* cancel the order.
You can do as you wish, along with the risks (with Customs/Laws, losing the shipping
price if returned, or losing an order...)
Then, yes, you should report them to BrickLink.
On the other side, those are very probably weak/tiny people... Total and GAFAs
make far more damages while not/few paying taxes, don't you think so?
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| | | | | Author: | jennnifer | | Posted: | Jan 16, 2024 09:57 | | Subject: | Re: Fraudulent requests to not pay TAXES | | Viewed: | 71 times | | Topic: | Problem Order | |
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| In Problem Order, BricksByTRiver writes:
| | Dear all,
In the last few months, we received 2 requests from buyers requesting us to fill
in the customs form with the total price much below the total cost to avoid paying
taxes in their countries (bigbao and lycaneart). Worst, they requested us to
commit fraud in our own country.
Those orders were canceled, so we lost 15 euros to PayPal fees.
If this happens again, we are thinking of not replying to the buyer about their
request and just sending the order with the customs form filled in correctly.
What do you think?
Don't you agree that the Bricklink Team could include a message in the newsletters
reinforcing the message that this kind of request is totally illegal everywhere
in the world, and it is not a special request from the stores (if they have that
information in terms of service)?
|
Honestly, I would just say no politely and then proceed with the order.
I think there is a cultural norm where fraud and stealing are one thing and avoiding
government fees and taxes are another. Yes, it's wrong and I am not justifying
it. But for many people it's just not a big deal.
Take care,
~Jen
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Portugal
Canada, Ontario
USA, Washington
Germany, Bayern
United Kingdom, England
Ireland, Meath
Netherlands, Gelderland
France, Provence-Alpes-Côte d'Azur