Discussion Forum: Thread 251638

 Author: palenjo View Messages Posted By palenjo
 Posted: May 2, 2019 14:36
 Subject: Inventory Change Request for Set 088-1
 Viewed: 19 times
 Topic: Inventories Requests (Entry)
 Status:Open
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palenjo (155)

Location:  Belgium, Flemish Brabant
Member Since Contact Type Status
Feb 1, 2009 Contact Member Buyer
Buying Privileges - OK
Please make changes to the following inventory:
 
Set No: 088  Name: Super Set
* 
088-1 (Inv) Super Set
615 Parts, 1969
Sets: Universal Building Set: Basic Set

* Add 1 Part 3195a Yellow Door 1 x 5 x 4 Left with Thin Handle (Alternate)
* Add 1 Part 3194a Yellow Door 1 x 5 x 4 Right with Thin Handle (Alternate)
 Author: randyf View Messages Posted By randyf
 Posted: May 2, 2019 15:27
 Subject: Re: Inventory Change Request for Set 088-1
 Viewed: 14 times
 Topic: Inventories Requests
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randyf (355)

Location:  USA, Ohio
Member Since Contact Type Status
Sep 16, 2009 Contact Member Seller
Buying Privileges - OKSelling Privileges - OK
Store Closed Store: The Bricking Spectre
BrickLink Inventories Administrator (?)
In Inventories Requests, palenjo writes:
  Please make changes to the following inventory:
 
Set No: 088  Name: Super Set
* 
088-1 (Inv) Super Set
615 Parts, 1969
Sets: Universal Building Set: Basic Set

* Add 1 Part 3195a Yellow Door 1 x 5 x 4 Left with Thin Handle (Alternate)
* Add 1 Part 3194a Yellow Door 1 x 5 x 4 Right with Thin Handle (Alternate)

You have not yet responded to my question on all of your other pending inventory
change requests, but I have the same one here.

Could you please let me know what your source is for making this request?

Thanks,
Randy
 Author: palenjo View Messages Posted By palenjo
 Posted: May 3, 2019 13:50
 Subject: Re: Inventory Change Request for Set 088-1
 Viewed: 22 times
 Topic: Inventories Requests
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palenjo (155)

Location:  Belgium, Flemish Brabant
Member Since Contact Type Status
Feb 1, 2009 Contact Member Buyer
Buying Privileges - OK
In Inventories Requests, randyf writes:
  In Inventories Requests, palenjo writes:
  Please make changes to the following inventory:
 
Set No: 088  Name: Super Set
* 
088-1 (Inv) Super Set
615 Parts, 1969
Sets: Universal Building Set: Basic Set

* Add 1 Part 3195a Yellow Door 1 x 5 x 4 Left with Thin Handle (Alternate)
* Add 1 Part 3194a Yellow Door 1 x 5 x 4 Right with Thin Handle (Alternate)

You have not yet responded to my question on all of your other pending inventory
change requests, but I have the same one here.

Could you please let me know what your source is for making this request?

Thanks,
Randy

Hi Randy!
Did you read my message in Suggestions posted on April 21? There's something
wrong if BL is overflowing with all these utility doors with thin handle, but
those doors only appear in the inventory of one set (341-1).
Why does nobody answer my suggestion posted on April 21? If you look at the boxes
of all the sets I have made inv. change requests to, plus the instructions, I
think it's pretty clear that you see doors with thin handle. Don't you?
For set 088-1 one could look at the big leaflet accompanying the set, there you
see doors with thin handle.

I only suggest the doors with thin handle as an alternate, so there should be
no commercial repercussions for sellers or buyers having amassed the parts for
these sets and looking for doors with open handle.

So my source is instructions and box covers for all the other sets, and the leaflet
for set 088.
Yours truly
Johan
 Author: randyf View Messages Posted By randyf
 Posted: May 3, 2019 15:04
 Subject: Re: Inventory Change Request for Set 088-1
 Viewed: 20 times
 Topic: Inventories Requests
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randyf (355)

Location:  USA, Ohio
Member Since Contact Type Status
Sep 16, 2009 Contact Member Seller
Buying Privileges - OKSelling Privileges - OK
Store Closed Store: The Bricking Spectre
BrickLink Inventories Administrator (?)
In Inventories Requests, palenjo writes:
  In Inventories Requests, randyf writes:
  In Inventories Requests, palenjo writes:
  Please make changes to the following inventory:
 
Set No: 088  Name: Super Set
* 
088-1 (Inv) Super Set
615 Parts, 1969
Sets: Universal Building Set: Basic Set

* Add 1 Part 3195a Yellow Door 1 x 5 x 4 Left with Thin Handle (Alternate)
* Add 1 Part 3194a Yellow Door 1 x 5 x 4 Right with Thin Handle (Alternate)

You have not yet responded to my question on all of your other pending inventory
change requests, but I have the same one here.

Could you please let me know what your source is for making this request?

Thanks,
Randy

Hi Randy!
Did you read my message in Suggestions posted on April 21?

I did now.

  There's something
wrong if BL is overflowing with all these utility doors with thin handle, but
those doors only appear in the inventory of one set (341-1).

Firstly, the doors with thin handle were only added to the BrickLink catalog
about one year ago. Therefore, until that point, there were only the original
entries for both versions of the doors (basically "undetermined" entries) as
they had not been separately recognized yet. Sellers could, in effect, only list
both versions of the doors under the original entries that were available.

Secondly, the doors with thick handle have not been added separately to the catalog
yet, so the original door entries are still "undetermined" entries and can contain
both versions of the doors. Sellers that have realized there are thin-handled
entries for the doors can choose to list their doors using those entries, but
they don't have to at this point because the original entries have not yet
been marked for deletion. Since the original entries have not been marked for
deletion, all of the relevant inventories that contain these entries are still
basically correct.

Thirdly, the reason the thin-handled doors only appear in one inventory is because
I researched that one set when you made a past Inventory Change Request and found
convincing evidence that the thin-handled doors had appeared in that set. I would
not have made the change without finding convincing proof, and I would not have
just referred to the box images or instructions for such a decision. At this
point, I do not have the time to go and research all of the other sets that you
are asking to make changes to.

  Why does nobody answer my suggestion posted on April 21?

The "Suggestions" topic is for posting things that you believe the BrickLink
development team should look into. It is not for posting things that deal with
the BrickLink catalog and BrickLink inventories. There are separate topics for
those that are monitored by the volunteer catalog and inventories administrators.

  If you look at the boxes
of all the sets I have made inv. change requests to, plus the instructions, I
think it's pretty clear that you see doors with thin handle. Don't you?

We do not make changes to inventories based on just set images or set instructions.

  For set 088-1 one could look at the big leaflet accompanying the set, there you
see doors with thin handle.

I only suggest the doors with thin handle as an alternate, so there should be
no commercial repercussions for sellers or buyers having amassed the parts for
these sets and looking for doors with open handle.

As stated above, sellers are free to list both versions of the doors under the
current entries because they are "undetermined" entries and do not represent
a specific variant of the part. If sellers want to use the thin-handled door
entries to list that specific version, then they are free to do so at this time,
but they are not currently required to. Once thick-handled entries have been
added to the BrickLink catalog and the original entries have been marked for
deletion, then sellers will be forced to choose which variant they need to list
under. Maybe you would be so inclined to submit catalog entries for the thick-handled
versions of the doors to get the process moving along more quickly?

  So my source is instructions and box covers for all the other sets, and the leaflet
for set 088.
Yours truly
Johan

If you do not have any proof besides instructions and box covers for all of these
sets, then I cannot accept any of them at this time. As stated before, since
all of the inventories currently contain "undetermined" entries, all of the inventories
are basically correct.

Please let me know if you have any further questions.

Cheers,
Randy
 Author: palenjo View Messages Posted By palenjo
 Posted: May 4, 2019 10:43
 Subject: Re: Inventory Change Request for Set 088-1
 Viewed: 18 times
 Topic: Inventories Requests
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palenjo (155)

Location:  Belgium, Flemish Brabant
Member Since Contact Type Status
Feb 1, 2009 Contact Member Buyer
Buying Privileges - OK
Thanks for your answer!
I'm a buyer on BL, so when I look at the inventory list for, for example
set 335-2, I see 1 entry for 445 yellow door 1x3x4 Left. So this is an "undetermined"
entry and encompasses door 445a? How am I supposed to know this?

I hesitate to submit "catalog entries for the thick-handled versions of the doors",
as you suggest. This will have commercial repercussions and some people who have
painstakingly amassed the set with original parts for sale on BL suddenly have
to find the type of door which you decide to list as the correct entry, if they
have the other type of door in their set for sale. I don't understand why
this problem cannot be solved by listing both type of doors in all the sets with
these types of doors, one type as alternative.

Could I also ask here for my other message on suggestions, about part 3009p01.
Is this part also an undetermined entry and encompasses 3009p01e? Because I have
ordered 3009p01 from 6 sellers on BL, and they have all sent me 3009p01e. And
part 3009p01e is not listed in any inventory.

For me as a buyer on BL it is difficult to understand that all these doors with
thin handle and part 3009p01, and other parts as well, are so plentiful on the
market here on BL, but do not appear in any set (except 341).

Yours truly

Johan


In Inventories Requests, randyf writes:
  In Inventories Requests, palenjo writes:
  In Inventories Requests, randyf writes:
  In Inventories Requests, palenjo writes:
  Please make changes to the following inventory:
 
Set No: 088  Name: Super Set
* 
088-1 (Inv) Super Set
615 Parts, 1969
Sets: Universal Building Set: Basic Set

* Add 1 Part 3195a Yellow Door 1 x 5 x 4 Left with Thin Handle (Alternate)
* Add 1 Part 3194a Yellow Door 1 x 5 x 4 Right with Thin Handle (Alternate)

You have not yet responded to my question on all of your other pending inventory
change requests, but I have the same one here.

Could you please let me know what your source is for making this request?

Thanks,
Randy

Hi Randy!
Did you read my message in Suggestions posted on April 21?

I did now.

  There's something
wrong if BL is overflowing with all these utility doors with thin handle, but
those doors only appear in the inventory of one set (341-1).

Firstly, the doors with thin handle were only added to the BrickLink catalog
about one year ago. Therefore, until that point, there were only the original
entries for both versions of the doors (basically "undetermined" entries) as
they had not been separately recognized yet. Sellers could, in effect, only list
both versions of the doors under the original entries that were available.

Secondly, the doors with thick handle have not been added separately to the catalog
yet, so the original door entries are still "undetermined" entries and can contain
both versions of the doors. Sellers that have realized there are thin-handled
entries for the doors can choose to list their doors using those entries, but
they don't have to at this point because the original entries have not yet
been marked for deletion. Since the original entries have not been marked for
deletion, all of the relevant inventories that contain these entries are still
basically correct.

Thirdly, the reason the thin-handled doors only appear in one inventory is because
I researched that one set when you made a past Inventory Change Request and found
convincing evidence that the thin-handled doors had appeared in that set. I would
not have made the change without finding convincing proof, and I would not have
just referred to the box images or instructions for such a decision. At this
point, I do not have the time to go and research all of the other sets that you
are asking to make changes to.

  Why does nobody answer my suggestion posted on April 21?

The "Suggestions" topic is for posting things that you believe the BrickLink
development team should look into. It is not for posting things that deal with
the BrickLink catalog and BrickLink inventories. There are separate topics for
those that are monitored by the volunteer catalog and inventories administrators.

  If you look at the boxes
of all the sets I have made inv. change requests to, plus the instructions, I
think it's pretty clear that you see doors with thin handle. Don't you?

We do not make changes to inventories based on just set images or set instructions.

  For set 088-1 one could look at the big leaflet accompanying the set, there you
see doors with thin handle.

I only suggest the doors with thin handle as an alternate, so there should be
no commercial repercussions for sellers or buyers having amassed the parts for
these sets and looking for doors with open handle.

As stated above, sellers are free to list both versions of the doors under the
current entries because they are "undetermined" entries and do not represent
a specific variant of the part. If sellers want to use the thin-handled door
entries to list that specific version, then they are free to do so at this time,
but they are not currently required to. Once thick-handled entries have been
added to the BrickLink catalog and the original entries have been marked for
deletion, then sellers will be forced to choose which variant they need to list
under. Maybe you would be so inclined to submit catalog entries for the thick-handled
versions of the doors to get the process moving along more quickly?

  So my source is instructions and box covers for all the other sets, and the leaflet
for set 088.
Yours truly
Johan

If you do not have any proof besides instructions and box covers for all of these
sets, then I cannot accept any of them at this time. As stated before, since
all of the inventories currently contain "undetermined" entries, all of the inventories
are basically correct.

Please let me know if you have any further questions.

Cheers,
Randy
 Author: randyf View Messages Posted By randyf
 Posted: May 4, 2019 13:43
 Subject: Re: Inventory Change Request for Set 088-1
 Viewed: 24 times
 Topic: Inventories Requests
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randyf (355)

Location:  USA, Ohio
Member Since Contact Type Status
Sep 16, 2009 Contact Member Seller
Buying Privileges - OKSelling Privileges - OK
Store Closed Store: The Bricking Spectre
BrickLink Inventories Administrator (?)
In Inventories Requests, palenjo writes:
  Thanks for your answer!

No problem! I am happy to help a fellow BrickLinker understand the ins and outs
of how things work around here.

  I'm a buyer on BL, so when I look at the inventory list for, for example
set 335-2, I see 1 entry for 445 yellow door 1x3x4 Left. So this is an "undetermined"
entry and encompasses door 445a? How am I supposed to know this?

This is how part variations have always been handled on BrickLink. Each standard
part entry is basically a placeholder for all variations of that part that have
ever been made. Until someone finds it important enough to split a part entry
into specific versions for specific variants of a part, the original entry remains
a "catch-all" entry. So for example, in this case, someone noticed that the original
entry for 445 contained two different variants of the part. They found it important
enough to add the thin-handled version to the catalog as a specific variant.
What they should have done at the same time was add the thick-handled version,
also, but they did not. As a result, the original entry for 445 needs to remain
to cover the thick-handled version of the part. When a thick-handled version
gets added to the catalog as 445b, then the process can be moved along to get
the part entry for 445 removed.

  I hesitate to submit "catalog entries for the thick-handled versions of the doors",
as you suggest. This will have commercial repercussions and some people who have
painstakingly amassed the set with original parts for sale on BL suddenly have
to find the type of door which you decide to list as the correct entry, if they
have the other type of door in their set for sale. I don't understand why
this problem cannot be solved by listing both type of doors in all the sets with
these types of doors, one type as alternative.

You have no need to worry. Like I stated above, this is the way things have always
been handled on BrickLink. The set inventories are not guaranteed to be 100%
correct, but the inventories do get more correct and more specific over time
as people contribute to growing the body of knowledge of the history of LEGO.

What is nice about splitting entries into specific variants over time as they
are found is that those who want a set from a certain era to contain the correct
vintage parts have a chance to get the correct parts. For example, in the one
set where we added the thin-handled doors, I am pretty certain that the thick-handled
versions of the doors never appeared in that set. Is it OK for the inventory
to show that the thick-handled versions of the door could have been in the set
when they actually never were? I personally don't think so. I think the inventory
for this set, as well as all of the other inventories containing these doors
should show the correct vintage parts. The only way to accomplish that is to
get specific entries for both variants into the catalog and then let users over
time make the necessary changes to the inventories (with proof) to get them corrected.
This process takes time, but it could be sped up if someone were to get the thick-handled
versions of the doors added to the catalog as separate entries.

  Could I also ask here for my other message on suggestions, about part 3009p01.
Is this part also an undetermined entry and encompasses 3009p01e? Because I have
ordered 3009p01 from 6 sellers on BL, and they have all sent me 3009p01e. And
part 3009p01e is not listed in any inventory.

I have not looked into this one. If it was posted as a Suggestion, also, then
I didn't see it.

  For me as a buyer on BL it is difficult to understand that all these doors with
thin handle and part 3009p01, and other parts as well, are so plentiful on the
market here on BL, but do not appear in any set (except 341).

Like I stated in the last message, the thin-handled versions were only added
as separate entries a little over a year ago. Therefore, the majority of the
doors listed on BrickLink would still be listed under the original entries. Because
of that, you can get any versions of the doors when you order using those original
entries.

The reason that the thin-handled versions are not in more inventories is because
the research has not been done since they were added to the catalog to determine
what inventories they should be placed in besides the one where they have been.
It takes a lot of time and patience to study these old sets, so changes to the
inventories are very slow to happen and require convincing proof. We don't
just add alternates and variants to sets unless those variants were actually
known with a large amount of confidence to have actually come in a set. You have
to remember that the catalog and inventory admins are just volunteers who do
not have unlimited time to study every inventory for complete accuracy and rely
a lot on the knowledge and help of others. Unfortunately, there are not enough
people out there with knowledge of these old sets to get things changed quickly.

Cheers,
Randy